Witness Prep Tool: Role-Playing
Once you’ve worked through mindset and organized things, the last piece of the puzzle in preparing for client deposition and trial preparation is role-playing.
As trial lawyers, we can do a better job at getting better results for the client. Most people haven’t experienced being in a deposition or trial before. And so, role-playing will give them a realistic experience before they step into the room or turn on that zoom to be asked questions under the spotlight. It helps remove first-time nerves, testing what is going to happen and what the reaction is going to be.
Role-playing is definitely an important aspect that may dictate the trajectory of your case. In this episode, I’m laying out the keys to effective role-playing so that both you and the client can get the most out of it. Learn how to compact roleplay into a digestible, easy exercise for everyone involved as well as some tips or tricks to supercharge it.
In this episode, you will hear:
- Another person to play as the opposing counsel
- Using roleplay to tackle the difficult and challenging questions
- Sticking with the exercise
- Roleplaying with different lawyers on different days
- Doing multiple rounds and checking in with the client in-between the rounds
- Ways to supercharge the roleplay
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Supporting Resources:
Need help crafting role play questions? Have a question about client testimony prep? Feel free to email me: elizabeth@larricklawfirm.com
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Episode Transcript:
Elizabeth Larrick: [00:00:00] Welcome to Trial Lawyer Prep. What if you could hang out with trial lawyers and jury consultants, ask them about connecting with clients and juries more effectively, then take strategies, tactics, and insights to increase your success? Each week, Elizabeth Larrick takes an in depth look at how to regain touch with the everyday world, understand the emotional burden of your clients and juries, and use focus groups in this process.
Elizabeth is an experienced trial lawyer, consultant, and founder of Larrick Law Firm in Austin, Texas. Her goal is to help you connect with juries and clients in order to improve your abilities in the courtroom. Now here’s Elizabeth. Hello and welcome to a new episode of Trial Lawyer Prep with me your host, Elizabeth Larrick.
This is a podcast designed to assist trial lawyers with how to tips, interviews other. tools that you can use to improve your cases, [00:01:00] connect with your clients and connect with jurors. I recently gave a panel discussion on the Kenan Trial Institute Employment Seminar, and we had a great discussion about role playing for deposition preparation.
And I thought, hey, let me just take the podcast and discuss a little bit about what we talked about on that panel discussion. But also some tips or tricks on how I run the role play to be the most effective. I talk about role play in the deposition prep and trial prep is really the last piece of the puzzle.
So we’ve worked through mindset, we’ve organized things, and now we’re practicing. And role play is key. The end. Hey, Roleplay is not new. People have been using Roleplay for a really long time. But I think that we can be doing a better job at it to get [00:02:00] better results for the client. And what I mean is we want to give Roleplay that gives the most realistic experience for clients before they step into that courtroom, before they step into that conference room or turn on that Zoom to be asked questions under the spotlight.
Bye. And it’s so important because most people don’t have this experience. There’s nothing really compared to it. And it’s hard to just describe it to someone and then have them be able to recreate that in their mind, like try to visualize it. It’s very, very difficult because again, super unique. So that’s why I think role play really helps do that.
We’re giving them a realistic experience, it does help remove first time nerves, and it helps really test what is going to happen. What is the reaction going to be? What is their response? Is there going to be strong resolve, or is it going to be full like a deck of [00:03:00] cards? What is it going to be? It’s really helpful for everybody to use role play, meaning the clients and the lawyers.
So what are the keys to effective role play? Number one, I always think you got to use another person, right? You can’t be. The opposing counsel in your role play for preparation, whether deposition or for trials, cross examination, you really need to use an outside person, someone who’s not involved, the client doesn’t know.
That’s because you need a fresh face, right? They’re used to seeing you there. They know you, there’s a personality connection there, right? Having this new fresh person was that there’s a lot of unknowns. Which that is what we’re trying to accomplish the role play right giving them an experience with something unknown.
So they’re new Unknown, they have no idea what they’re gonna get because they don’t know this person It also allows this person to really take a different approach or different approaches to asking questions, to seeing what’s going to [00:04:00] work, to trying different things out as far as looks for the role play.
So effective role play has got to have another person come in to play that opposing counsel. And these days it is super easy to do with Zoom, all right, and we’re going to talk about how to make it even easier, right, for those people that you’re asking for help, asking them to come in and play that outside person.
You can use somebody else in your office, absolutely, just, what I’m trying to impress upon you is somebody who’s outside the case. It could be another paralegal or a lawyer who’s not assigned to the case. Another important key to effective role play is setting the topics and the questions. to be difficult and challenging.
You really want to give the hardest possible role play. You want to give those hard questions. You want to hit the hard topics. Easy stuff’s not really going to be a problem for people. They know where they went to high school. They know what The [00:05:00] job was two days ago. Those are easy questions. Use the role play to tackle the hard stuff, right?
Cause that’s where you want the test to be. That’s where the client wants to test me. You know, Hey, show me the hardest stuff. And it’s makes it when you’re using an outside person and you’ve already set the topics and you’ve already set the questions, you’re making it so much easier for somebody else to volunteer their time.
It’s like, Oh, You’ve already got the topic set out. Oh, you’ve got the questions. Oh, perfect. This is great. That also allows you as the lawyer, when you’re listening and going through, you can watch and see which questions are the struggle. You’ve already got written out so that when you have to go back and talk about it, you can say, Hey, this question, let’s go back over this.
Let me read it to you. Tell me what’s going on. What’s what you’re thinking about. That really helps. Digest the question and the problem like what is the trick of that question versus if you just try to do it off the cuff Or you have somebody come in [00:06:00] off the cuff It’s much more difficult for you to be writing that question down Verbatim that was the stumper or that they were Folded on so if you have already written out makes it very easy for you to track and go back and talk about the questions Another key point of effective roleplay is actually sticking to the exercise So many times I have people want to break the roleplay, right?
Well, they want to you know, well, hey, did you Oh, okay. We’re really in it. Oh, okay. Okay. Right. And it’s like, no, to really have that true experience, you’ve got to stick with the role play. You got to stay in the exercise. Okay. And that’s so hard to do for everybody, especially if somebody’s laughing or whatever, it’s hard to, it’s hard to be, stay in the seriousness of it.
But, and here’s like what I have come up with to help with all three of these things. And that is when I set up to do role play for the first time, and I’ve learned it in my seminar, there’s lots of lawyers that We’ll do the role [00:07:00] play multiple times, maybe even with different lawyers on different days.
It’s a great idea. Totally should do it. Let’s just take it from the first go round. So, we’re going to set up role play. I’ll ask somebody else to come in. And what I want to do is set up a 30 minute time block. So I’m going to ask that other lawyer, hey, 30 minutes? Okay, we’re going to do some role play with this client.
I’m going to send you a little synopsis of the facts. Thanks. Maybe I’ll send you the police report. Maybe it’s a picture of the cars. And then here are the topics and here are the questions. Boom. So what, oh great. You got it all set up? Yes, I can. Okay, perfect. Alright. Boom. I got my other person. My questions are done.
My topics are set down. Now on the day of, what I do is client, either if we’re in person or if we’re on the Zoom. Either way, it doesn’t matter. The format is still the same. What I tell them is we’re going to role play. And that means you’re going to play yourself. I’m going to play your lawyer and Steve’s going to [00:08:00] join us and he’s going to join us on Zoom and he is going to be the opposing counsel and we’re going to actually practice like a real deposition.
He’s going to ask you questions, you’re going to answer them, right, and we’re just going to go through and actually have a real look at how this is going to be. Okay. Okay. Okay. How we actually format this is we’re going to set a timer for eight to 10 minutes. And what’s going to happen is we’re going to swear you in as a witness and we’re going to go.
And that means Steve’s going to ask you questions for eight to 10 minutes straight. As soon as the timer goes off, we’re going to pause. We’re going to stop the role play, check in, and then we’re going to go again. Now, you’re going to do three rounds that way, because you got your other lawyer there for 30 minutes.
So let’s maximize that other lawyer, right? So that means our pause in between each round is 30 seconds to a minute. All we’re doing in between rounds is checking in with the client. How are you doing? [00:09:00] What questions were challenging? Anything you didn’t like. Okay, great. We’re going to go again. Steve’s going to go in.
He’s going to ask you some other questions now. So each round is a different set of questions. Maybe it’s a different topic. And what you’re doing is you’re watching. You’re watching body language. You’re watching where are they having a problem. You’re highlighting the questions that are the problems.
You’re making notes. You can really focus in and tune into what they’re doing. And Steve’s just doing his thing. So that’s also why we want to have somebody else do it, the role play so that you can really hone in on what is it that they’re doing? Is it, is there just a major malfunction, a major disconnect, or is there a problem you’ve talked about, but now it’s back.
You’re going to be able to be present for all those things because somebody else is actually asking the questions. And once you finish all three rounds at the end, [00:10:00] then you can ask the other lawyer, Hey, Steve. Do you feel like there’s a question that you really got the client on, right? You got them to answer the way you wanted.
Oh, yeah, it was this question right here. Okay, great. Any other feedback about where, in your point of view as the opposing counsel, that you scored some points or you saw some weaknesses? Oh, yeah, it was A, B, C, D. All right, awesome. Thanks, Steve. You can leave. Boop, Steve’s gone. Now then, it’s your turn, right, to give feedback.
So we’ve been doing all these rounds, three rounds, taking notes and not giving any feedback, withholding any feedback. Why? Because we want to make sure we go through all the rounds. We want all the different looks. We want to have all these notes. Then we stop regroup and then we go back. We’ve highlighted the questions that were issues or the topics.
Right now we can just go back and look at those. And hey, do you remember what you said to this one? This is, hey, this is what you said. Hey, here’s this question, right? Then we really go through and look at the feedback. After they’ve had the full, [00:11:00] 24 minutes, 30 minutes of really grueling role play. And then we go back and look at, there’s this issue, we need to go back and reorganize this answer, or hey, there’s a whole nother topic we never talked about, but this was your reaction, how are you feeling, all that, but we’ve really compacted role play into a digestible, easy exercise for the other person, other lawyer, for you and for the client.
We’re packing it in. We’re doing as much work as we can in 30 minutes. That’s why I say make them challenging questions. Make them intense questions. Make sure that the other lawyer knows like you’re playing like this particular opposing counsel. So if you want to get really supercharged your role play, All right, the best way to do this one find old depositions taken by the opposing counsel of other plaintiffs so you can get the exact questions.
Do they ask the same thing every time? Maybe they don’t. Either way, you’re going to have the exact wording, which is always [00:12:00] important. Our lawyer, wording is different than regular conversation. So very important to give that look when you’re doing role play. Another way to supercharge the role play is to have the other lawyer use different tactics.
Sometimes we don’t have time for that. Sometimes we do. If you have somebody who, for example, Debra Hensley, who you’ve met on the podcast, she’s here in Austin, has practice here, and she and I role play with each other very often. I’ll call her, she calls me, hey, you got 30 minutes, 30 minutes, yep, yep, yep.
Because we were so used to doing that together with each other, I already know I can weave in other little things. tactics to try because I know I’m going to be able to hit all of her questions and I’m going to be able to weave in the different tactics. And by what I mean by that is using silence.
ignoring the person, never making eye contact, just looking down, taking notes, asking questions immediately after an answer, basically just allowing zero time in between [00:13:00] question and answer, being really friendly, being a total jerk, objection non responsive, right? Just trying all these different styles along with challenging questions, right?
So just really, really heaping it in there in that 30 minutes. is so helpful. Again, you’re trying to give the most realistic look, you’re packing a punch with that 30 minutes and with that other lawyer who’s helping you. And it can really significantly test the preparation that’s been done. And that’s why I always encourage people to do the role play after you’ve done preparation.
After you’ve looked at what are the difficult parts of this case, look at what the truths are, let’s organize your truths, right? Let’s do some work together before you get in a role play because if you get in a role play too early, they’re going to be really discouraged. Right? Like, wow, this is just hopeless.
There’s no way I’m gonna survive this thing. I’m just gonna roll over. We don’t want them to be hopeless. We do want them to give them [00:14:00] a realistic experience and that way they know, hey, I just totally froze up in there. Or, wow, I just, I could not stop talking. Whatever their experience is, they go through it and they’ve, whoa, oh, wow.
Okay. I felt that. I know. Okay. All right. Now I feel a little bit more prepared. When I have that lockup feeling I’ll just take a break or when I have that oh my gosh I need to have verbal diarrhea all over the steps. I should like stop and that also gives you the lawyer the same Benefit, so if you see the behavior you can also take a break and just check in Because that’s sometimes all that we need to do is have that check in moment.
Come back to presence. And that’s why we do the role play that we do, so that you could check in with how they’re feeling. What’s going on in your brain? Are you exhausted? Are you, hey, this is what’s going on. Do you realize you’re even doing that? Sometimes people don’t even know. Some people are fidgeters.
They know they fidget. Some people [00:15:00] have a no idea that they’re fidgeting. Until you say, hey, you’re fidgeting. Like you’re rocking in your chair the whole time. Did you even know you did that? I had no idea. So all these things are super helpful and again, we had this amazing discussion about how helpful roleplay can be and the purpose is to give a realistic experience which may be a roleplay that You know, the client doesn’t master.
They’re not, okay, I get a kick, but they’re going to come out of the sink and wow, whoa, that’s what this thing’s going to be like. Okay. Like I know why we’re preparing and they also feel like, okay, I got this right. Thank you for giving the experience so that I can know what to prepare for better. And again, people always walk in to prep.
First thing they say is what are the questions you’re going to ask me? Boom, we’re going to give it to them, especially if you’ve supercharged your role play with actual questions from the same opposing counsel, which I encourage you to do. You can find that by having people who’ve had cases with that opposing counsel or just asking your local [00:16:00] listserv, or if you’re part of any listserv at all.
Please join one because they’re super helpful with all kinds of things. If you have questions about roleplay or you need some help with roleplay, please don’t hesitate to email me. Love to exchange roleplay time with other folks. Just know that I will absolutely call you and ask you to do the same. So thank you so much for listening here today.
I hope that you found this podcast helpful. Please rate and review on your favorite platform. Share this podcast or this episode with a lawyer who, you know, may be needing it in this moment. And as always, thank you so much.